EP.02 - Trading Traditional Accounting for Love
Kristine Miguel shares her story of trading a traditional accounting career for love - but not the way you think! I was curious about her transition from her linear CPA career path to starting her own business based on love, financial education, and empowerment. We discuss the challenges she faced and the lessons she learned while creating her intentional career; and some thoughts on spirituality and the coaching industry. Listen to the episode on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or on my website.
Transcription
Transcription created with DeScript.
(Transcription has been edited for clarity.)
Karen: I'm Karen Styles. And this is the Intentional Career Podcast. I talk to all kinds of people who take all kinds of paths to work they love. I'm a career and life coach and owner of Flow + Fire coaching. If you're ready to create your Intentional Career with the support of a coach, schedule a call with me.
There's a link in the show notes, or you can go to intentionalcareer.co and click the blue “Schedule a Call” button.
Today on the show. My guest is Kristine Miguel, owner of Carita's Company. She's a chartered professional accountant, mom, small business owner and all around financial hype woman. She offers startups, entrepreneurs, and side hustlers an approachable way to face their fear around money and combat overwhelm so they can build and grow a financially sustainable business.
Welcome, and thank you so much for being here, Kristine.
Kristine: Hello, hello!
Karen: So excited to have you here.
Kristine: I'm so pumped. Yeah. Thank you for having me.
Karen: Yeah. I wanna start with, “how it started, how it's going,” or that's the overview of what we're going to have today. So you're an accountant, a CPA. Take us back to how that started for you or what made you pursue accounting as a career path?
Kristine: Oooh. I kind of fell into the accounting path, mostly due to my love for math. Okay. So growing up math was my favorite subject in school. I did so well in math. Like it's ridiculous when I think about it. And so I wanted a career. In math or something to do with numbers. Yeah. And I also being the oldest child of four kids, I was always like the leader, the leaders slash I was always, my parents left me to teach my siblings, whatever it is they wanted me to teach.
I was very comfortable teaching. And being bossy and I love math. And so I actually wanted to be a math teacher coming out of high school. I'm not sure if you remember that feeling where you're like, oh, okay. High school kids are... not the best. So I don't want to be around with people. Like I don't want to teach people like me, not me necessarily, because I was such a good kid.
I'm saying that was sarcasm obviously, but I was just like, I don't know if I want to work in a school, necessarily. So when I was applying for university, I exited out of the education portal and I was like, Ooh, people say you should get a business degree because it's so versatile.
So I went into the business degree portal instead, and I found I was like, what has something to do with math? And so it was like finance and accounting. And I was like, oh, I don't really want to do finance. Oh, let's just do accounting. So I just applied for it. I got accepted and yeah, that's where I started and how I fell into this.
Karen: That's interesting because... accounting wasn't obvious for you.
Kristine: No, I didn't even know what it was really.
Karen: Yeah. Yeah. And that kind of makes sense. Like when we're young, you're really only exposed to at least for me, I wasn't exposed to that many career paths. Like doctors and teachers and whoever's in your life, but, sometimes you don't know what's available to you. The thing about accounting is that it's pretty linear. Like when I think of linear, always talk about accountants and make broad generalizations. And, back when I was an executive recruiter,when I was recruiting accountants, I remember cause I was going through my own career angst and I remember being jealous of that linear path.
Kristine: I see.
Karen: I was like, wouldn't it be nice to be an accountant? You go work in a firm in audit and then you work your way up, maybe go to corporate and you become a manager and then a controller and a director or VP of finance, like I was like, wouldn't that be... oh, that'd be so nice if I just do where to go. If someone just told me what the path was, and also knowing that you make a ton of money.
Kristine: Yes!
Karen: And then, but then I also knew that wasn't for me. Like maybe I could improve my math skills, but I was pretty damn sure that I couldn't be an accountant. So it's interesting. But I had this kind of longing for - wouldn't it be nice if it was so easy?
Kristine: Oh, I have so much to say about that.
Karen: Yes, please tell me what you have to say about that.
Kristine: Okay. So you mentioned a few things where linear paths are usually accountant paths and being envious of people, telling you where to go and what to do.
[05:00] I am going to say you are not incorrect about that. Everything about that statement is correct in that. All accountants, somehow we just fall into this career path and then we are told what to do what the next position is what the pay is for that position. And we just follow. So accountants are very good for rule followers. First of all, because obviously, we have to follow all these freaking rules
Karen: Yeah, they need to be.
Kristine: I need to be able to read the rules and then apply it to my life or not my life, but my client’s books or my company's books. So we are super rule followers. And I want to - we'll probably talk more about this later - but that was my downfall and that's what I hated the most about it. And so I think at first it's great because you're young, impressionable, and then you ha you don't really know okay. One other thing that you said was you, was like when you're growing up, nobody tells you what, here are all the career paths.
It's more like who, what careers have been in place in your family? Who do you aspire to be within your family? So you choose a career path based on if your mom was a nurse or dad was a doctor, et cetera. My parents never did that actually contrary to the usual, like Asian culture. They never told me, like, you need to be a nurse or you need to be this or that, which I am so grateful for. They never told me what to be.
But then I felt like, I didn't know what to do. As a young person, and so being in an accounting career path was so comfortable. Because once you get into school, you told, they told you what to take, what, what courses to take. And then in third year, you get to apply for summer jobs.
And these, the summer jobs are a set number of positions, or, it's like a set position that everybody does. So think of an assembly line, but for human careers. Like a human professional assembly line. And that's what accountants did. And they produce the same exact result every single time.
And thinking back, that's good for the public, obviously, because we need to be consistent. We need to be reliable. But you couldn't just do whatever the frick you wanted. And that bothered me a lot.
Karen: Interesting. So like you said, it's comfortable. I could see how it's also comforting where, like I know what's in the next step. I know what there's a structure, there's a path. You can just keep doing the next thing. You don't have to like, worry about it.
Kristine: Exactly.
Karen: But then, there comes in your life where you're like, wait a second...
Kristine: 10 years in. You're like, what? Wait, what? You wake up one day. And you're like this was nice oh, so nice. I have a paycheck. I have a job to go to. I'm constantly busy. Like it's so comfortable. It's so predictable. And then you're like, but what if I want to do this other thing? And it's no, you can't do that. Cause that's not in the plan. It's like, but why?
Karen: Okay. So let's talk about that because now you're a business owner and, I think there are a lot of accountants that might open a bookkeeping firm, or they do tax services. And what you do is a bit different.
Kristine: So different.
Karen: What happened for you? You said you woke up one day and what was that moment for you or was what led to the change? Was there a moment where you were like, okay, this has got to change? I think I want to step out of this, this path that's been given to me.
Kristine: Yes, yes. Oh my gosh. Okay. So when you're in the path, like when you're in the assembly line, You basically get given, like they dangle carrot sticks in front of you where they're like, this is the next promotion with this price tag. And you're essentially like, you are rewarded for your efforts and for showing up in terms of positions and money, which are all prestigious, they're all like things to aspire to.
I'm not really talking negatively about those because it really does work. But one day the reward. So one day I didn't, I can't say I woke up one day. It was a lot of many days that I woke up that I was so unmotivated and I thought to myself, okay what am I working for here? So I got all the way to you described that career path.
I got all the way to manager or financial reporting for a public construction company, which is it was such a good position leadership position. I was so good at my job. Everybody loved me, but then. All these new rules would come up for, IFRS. So IFRS is International Financial Reporting Standards. And one day I just remember thinking I don't care about these rules and nobody else does.
Karen: And I'm the one who's supposed to care!
Kristine: Exactly. And I'm like, what? This is weird. And at that time, like usually I would. Fall back to, oh, here's a reward. It'll be fine. But the rewards never amounted to how much I hated it anymore.
[10:00] Like the diminishing returns concept where no amount of reward, no amount of, like, title you could give me would make me happy anymore. And I knew that, looking ahead, because we knew where we were going to be in like 10 years time, 20 years time, I looked at the lives of my leaders - and they were great leaders by the way - but I just, I didn't see myself in it anymore.
And so many days, the waking up being unmotivated and I was in charge of this big, huge, conversion. So a conversion to a new IFRS standard where you had to lead the company to adopt the standards by changing process, changing people's ways of doing things and doing that.
I realized nobody gives a shit about these rules. It got to a point where those rules that were being made, didn't even make sense to me anymore where it's, is this just a rule for compliance so that we can have 60 pages of documentation versus one page?
And if that's the case, you're just making us do busy work and everybody in the company hated it. And being a natural people pleaser. I hated it too. Because nobody liked what I was doing anymore. And that's when I wasn't getting any rewards out of it. So ...
Karen: In terms of emotional rewards, right? Or like, how you were feeling? Like you didn't feel proud of it or connected to it or..?
Kristine: Yeah, I didn't feel connected to it. I didn't feel proud of it. Yeah. So long story short, there's so much to unpack there, but it was like, I wasn't, I love being like the helper, the leader that people. They agreed with what I was doing and I got support. I love having support again, like I said, people pleaser, but it was just, that was the beginning when I wouldn't, nobody cared about it. I didn't care about it. So I'm like, okay time to do something else
Karen: Yeah and it sounds like you went from following that external path and the people pleasing to really listening to yourself more.
Kristine: Exactly where it's kinda, it started with okay, I'm not pleasing people anymore and I'm not pleased myself. Like what the hell is happening?
Karen: So now what do I do? So when did you decide to start your own business?
Kristine: Yeah, so I was, so I've been doing accounting, like the traditional accounting path since 2007. And then finally in 2015, I think it was the year of change. Like I got married that year and then I also got this promotion to manager.
So in 2015, I was reading this magazine and this girl, this lady was on the cover and she was talking about paving her own career path as a CPA. And I was like, I am so jealous of this lady. And so I contacted her. Yeah, I totally fan girled. I contacted her and I asked her, like, what, how the hell did you do this?
And so that was the beginning. And then, so the fall of 2015 was when I started Caritas Company as a side hustle and then went into it full-time in 2018. No 2019, because I was on mat leave. So I've been doing this full-time for, almost for two years now, actually, this month was the time I went full time in 2019.
Karen: Oh, it's your business birthday!
Kristine: It is my business birthday! I just don't know what date. Like, I don't even
know...
Karen: But that gives you an excuse to go get a cake or a cupcake or something and celebrate. Woohoo!
Kristine: Oh, So true. Yeah, exactly. It's like one of those things that, because I started it a long time ago. As a side hustle I don't have a birthday because it wasn't, one day I woke up kind of thing. It was like many days of waking up being like, I want something else.
Karen: Yeah. Yeah. And unless… the only reason I know my date is I went through a business program where my business coach was like, your launch date is this. And I'm actually really glad I have that. Because otherwise. You're doing the work in the background and maybe you're taking on clients here, but you're not sure you don't fall into it, you don't plan it that way... maybe some people can do it on their own. But for me anyway,I had help.
Kristine: I have a launch date for Bookkeeping Bootcamp. So that's one of my signature programs. I know exactly when I started that. But Caritas Company in general, I think I can't even tell you a date, right?
Karen: Yeah. And what does Caritas mean? Why did you name your company Caritas?
Kristine: Okay, so Caritas is actually a Latin word for direct translation is charity.
But when we think about charity, we think of giving to a charity or an organization that helps people do X, Y, Z. But the real meaning, the original meaning of charity is actually love, which is it's the virtue of charity in a religious standpoint. And I'm going to give you like five meetings because it's very deep.
[15:00] Charity, which has also a love, which also translates to God's love for his people. So it's like that, that Christian Love, unconditional love that I'm going to be here for you. Love that you surrender to me. I'm going to be here for you. Love. So I love that you pulled that card because...
Karen: For our listeners, I pulled a card before we started. And it said, “I surrender to a power greater than me.”
Kristine: And my entire life has been about surrendering to a greater power because, man, if it was all up to me, like, the world is screwed seriously. If it was all up to just us. Yeah. The world is totally screwed. So anyway, Caritas, it just goes back to my roots. I didn't want my company as something like, oh, Kristine Miguel Consulting or something like that. Cause obviously that's it's predictable and I'm over that. And I wanted my company to grow with me. Even if I didn't want to do financial stuff anymore, I can still be Caritas Company because it is super true to my values. My number one value is love. So that's the background story.
Karen: It's so cool. Cause I think people wouldn't necessarily... I certainly wouldn't put love and accounting together. And obviously, your goal is bigger and deeper than that. And you have these spiritual elements of surrender and also the elements of I'm here for you, which is yes, totally what you do in your business. And I've experienced it because I've been through Bookkeeping Bootcamp. And it's one of those things that we really need.
Cause I think for those of us who do have fear around our financial background or we're starting a business. There's always this fear of, you're so smart with numbers, I feel stupid, like you're probably going to be bored by this, or you're going to judge me or all of this stuff.
And it was really nice to have none of that. None of the fears come true. And having the support and I can see that love and the support behind your business I've experienced it. It's easy to have generalizations about what accountants are like, even though I know lots of creative, vibrant accountants, they're not the stereotype, but it's really cool to experience that.
Kristine: And I love that you pointed out fear because the opposite of love is actually fear. It's not hate. Yeah, the opposite of love is not hate. It's fear because you're scared to give it a, give it your all. You're scared for people to come into your life. You're scared for money to come into your life. Right?
And so I always say fear prevents learning while love promotes learning. And so going back to my company name my personal value is love. But I also know that small business owners, they do what they do because of love, because they love what they do. They love, they want to create a life they love so they can keep doing what they love. And so when I was going through this, like naming my business exercises, I was just like, love is just the number one. That's it for everybody.
Karen: That's so cool that you were just like, I'm going to go for this. And I feel like I would have been so afraid that [the name] doesn't make sense. That it's not going to make sense to anybody. And I love that. You're just like, I'm an accountant and love is the most important thing. And that's what I'm going to name my company. But I'm sure that draws the exact right people to you.
Kristine: I hope it has drawn the right people and I love having the conversation of like, why is your name Caritas? They thought that my name, like maybe my middle name was Caritas and, Oh there has, there have been days when I'm like, if only my business name was like something consulting, people will understand better, but I'm like, you know what, it's fine. I can talk to them about it. And. It's just going to be a help.
Everyone now is going to know that Caritas in Latin is love, right? Some days I'm like, why did I name this company like this? And I'm like, oh yeah!
Karen: I remember.
Kristine: Cause of love. Remember, and it reminds me every day. When I'm having the worst day ever, it reminds me that I keep having to go, that I have to go back to love. That's what I have to keep going back to. And that's been true for my entire life when I'm feeling like it's not working, go back to love, go back to love. So it's a good reminder for me.
Karen: Yeah. And you can't forget.
Kristine: I cannot forget because it's everywhere. Exactly. Yeah.
Karen: You mentioned the individual that you reached out to like seeing this other mentor and realizing that there was a career that maybe you could have. What else, like what other wisdom or advice or resources helped you to go from that path that you didn't choose to your intentional career in and creating this business?
Kristine: [20:02] You know what, aside from that lady that was an accountant. I didn't have too many accountants who I aspired to be. But my clients, meaning small business owners and entrepreneurs, were my biggest inspiration. Because entrepreneurs, they're like my career crushes. Because I'm just working over here on my accounting stuff, and then I go on Instagram or I talk to a small business owner and they're just in a coffee shop. I'm looking at it from the other perspective where I'm like, it's so nice that they can just go to a coffee shop, do their work. And then go home whenever they want, do whatever they want at whatever time they want.
And I'm like such a night owl that I work at night and I can see that small business owners work at night all the time back then. I didn't understand why they worked at night all the time. Now I do because we have endless work. They were my inspiration to just be like, Hey, look, this person, her background was whatever it was. And now she is making, like, greeting cards that are so amazing and make people happy. So I aspire to be somebody who did something that people appreciated and that really truly help people to their core rather than help people be because of their compliance requirements and stuff like that, right? Like the classic accountant. So I don't know if that answers your question. But it's more I was just inspired by creative community.
Karen: And it sounds like you want it to be a part of that.
Kristine: Yes. Creatives give me life and that's because they bring out in me, what I always had all along. And I knew I always had that cause I was always growing up. I love being like the class clown. I was always the silly one. I'm never serious. And even in my traditional career path, people always saw me as that weirdo, that, I was just always happy. And they were like, why are you always happy? Like this job sucks. And I'm like, I know it does, but. Can't do anything about that. And so creatives gave me this life that I was looking for.
Karen: That's interesting. It reminds me of, I used to have an Etsy shop and I was part of markets and I had a creator life that was part of my side hustle that didn't work out for me in the end. But one of the things was, I love that community too. Like I am a creative person, but I discovered that I didn't want to make and sell objects. Like I wanted the people, so that was part of it too. I did want to connect with the people. I loved that community and that's one of the reasons I'm really glad I did that, even though it didn't turn out to be like a traditionally successful step. But yeah, there's so many people that I love and connect with.
Kristine: Yeah. That resonates with me because people say that accountants are not creative people because we're not allowed to be, obviously. But I always said that I'm creative, but I'm not artistic. And so when you mentioned making things to sell, like I can, no, I can't make shit for to save my life or to sell to people, but I have all these creative ideas that.
I want people to execute for me. Yeah. It's just I don't have design experience at all. Like I suck at design, but I'm like, Hey, wouldn't it be cool if we had this thing. And then I call my designer friends and then they just do it for me. And I'm like, oh, such genius. Good job.
Karen: Yeah. I think, being creative is a human trait. And I think, to be honest, yeah, not everybody's an artist or sometimes we think of it in terms of being able to draw or able to paint. And there are so many ways to be creative. And a lot of times that applies to problem solving, to be honest. And that's one of the things that I know, like, everyone's creative. Just because someone - usually someone in your childhood - looking at a picture and saying that you're not good at it. And we hold onto those things, stop doing the things that we love. That's kind of an aside.
Kristine: That's a story for another day.
Karen: Yeah, for sure.
Kristine: It's like, why are we like this?
Karen: Yeah. Cause someone told you it wasn't perfect or something. Did you have any advice that you ignored - to your benefit?
Kristine: Yes. When I was on that traditional career path, I mentioned to, a few colleagues like the close ones, many times that I just wanted to be a housewife, or I didn't want to be an accountant anymore, or I didn't want to do CPA stuff. Like I didn't want to be a partner in a firm. I didn't want to be this. I didn't want to be that. And everyone - cause we were still so young back then - and they're like, then why did you get your CPA? What a waste of time. It's like why did you go through all of that if you just wanted to be a mom? And I'm like, excuse me, I'm going to teach my kids, everything that I learned from this program, just watch.
And so I ignored the advice that you had to be a partner. That you had to follow the rest of the way in this path. Just stay for a few more years, Get another promotion and things like that. I ignored that because, those annual performance reviews, that I freaking hate so much. I don't know if you hate those reviews...
Karen: [25:44] I think there's good and bad. I think the process is usually a pain. Hopefully, you can learn something good about yourself, and find some pride and identify some of your skills and stuff. But a lot of that process is painful and companies make it painful.
Kristine: It's so painful. So in those performance reviews every year, they'd be like, okay, in order to get to the next level, we think you should do X, Y, Z. I'd be like, no, not doing that. I'm like, no, even if I don't do that, I will still get to the next level, because that's the linear progression. Just give it some time and then you're going to get there.
And so I ignored some of the advice, especially in the later stages, because I feel like they were just lying to me. Not lying to me, but it just never connected with me anymore. And so that's when I started ignoring the advice that I should do X, Y, Z.
Karen: I feel like, an intentional career comes back to choice. And sometimes we have to just choose little ways for ourselves. But I kind of buck against that too, where somebody says, you're going to do this now. It's just no, I'm not. At the end of the day, you have to identify, I almost don't want to say success, because that sounds like such an external cultural word, but what work feels good to you. You get to decide that for you and you don't have to live it according to somebody else's definition for you.
From where you are now, when you think back to that person who was frustrated, who was unmotivated, who probably woke up and it was like, oh, another day of this. What would you say to that version of yourself? What would you encourage her with? What words of wisdom would you offer her?
Kristine: Gosh, that is a loaded question. I think I would still say to her to serve, to surrender to that higher power and keep asking for where to go next, because eventually. This little lady will find her way. You know what I mean? So I, yeah, like I don't think I would change a thing. I would just tell her to keep searching. Keep going.
Karen: You had a smile on your face there.
Kristine: Yes. I was like gonna tear up, obviously [laughs]. Because I still remember those days very vividly where I'm just like, I cried to my husband, I don't want to go to work anymore. And it's so weird because once I was at work, I would literally, no one could tell.
Like I would put on this face, like everything was okay. I'm also such a good actress that I could fool everybody really. But then when I got home, I was just like broken and...yeah. So I had a smile on my face because I think I came through to the other side, getting exactly what it was I asked for. So I asked for courage really? That's what it was
Karen: Courage.
Kristine: Courage to break through, or how do you say that? Break away from that path. I was talking to one of my Slay the Mic cohort classmates two weeks ago about this, and you need the courage to get off that path. It's not, cause it's not easy. Yeah. Because there is that path it's laid out for you, what's next, you know what price tag comes with it. And it's so hard to just say no to all of it. And so yeah, I needed that courage for sure.
Karen: Yeah, because it's known, right? Like here's the path, here's what you're gonna get. And then if I do something else, it's just a big question, mark. That's what, that was my experience too, where I'm like, okay, I think I want something else, but I don't know what the something else is.
Kristine: Exactly. Yes.
Karen: So it's tricky when you're at that point. Okay, what do I choose this void, this vacuum?
Kristine: Yeah. And we talked about being on a train or the subway or whatever. You're on it, you hop on and then it's going somewhere and you know what that destination is because obviously. It tells you where it's going and then there's so many everyone there is yeah, I'm so happy.
[30:22]I'm going to be going to this place. Are you excited? Yeah, I'm excited. Perfect. Let's all continue on this train and then you have to get off and once you get off, people are like, yo, why are you getting off? What's wrong with you. What's wrong with you? Come back here. You don't know where that, you know what, you don't know when the next train is coming.
You don't know if there's another train. But we all know this train is going to this place. So come back. So it's, like, when I was talking to my classmates, it was, that's what we were envisioning. Cause he dropped out of law and he felt the same exact way where it's like, everyone's going this way and we're like, no, we're not, hop off the train, please. Please be okay.
Karen: Yeah. I hope there's another train that's going to take me somewhere better.
Kristine: Yeah. Or I guess we'll have to take the stairs up back to wherever it is that to find the next train.. I dunno.
Karen: Yeah. And it is an act of courage and an act of faith.
Kristine: Yeah, exactly. Crazy!
Karen: Yeah. And also it's interesting probably to discover that, it's okay. It's so scary when you're looking at it, but, oh look, I can actually figure this out.
Kristine: Yeah. And you have it in you to figure it out. So once you do experience that void and that feeling of, Hey, I could be doing something else. Just keep asking. Keep talking to people, keep exploring and don't stop until you're like, Hey, I have arrived. On a different train and I can hop off whenever I want also, once the train is not going where I want to be.
Karen: Yeah. I, that feeling matters. I think we tell ourselves that the feeling - or at least I did - this is just a feeling and maybe I can force myself to feel different or maybe I can convince myself that the things I have are okay. But when that keeps coming up, it's also information, right? You have information about career paths, but the feeling that's telling you, I don't think so, is also important information.
Kristine: Gosh, we're so good at suppressing those feelings. We are so trained to do that.
Karen: Yeah. Yeah.
Kristine: Especially as women actually. Right? Do you agree? Like I see men do so many amazing, crazy things. And I'm like, how did you get that courage to do that? Like, How did you think that was okay. And then I'm like, wait a minute. I can think the same way. Whereas women were more like, hm, let me talk to my girlfriends about this.
We go call each other up and we're just like, what do you think? What do you think? What do you think? What do you think? I feel like women because we're allowed to have those feelings. Like we talked to everybody and then we don't know what to do after. Whereas a man is just, because I have no one to talk to these feelings about because I can't, I'm just going to do it.
That’s what I think is happening. And I feel like if women just, you can still do that, you can still call your girlfriends, but then still do the thing that you want to do.I feel like we're so caught up in trying to get approval from our peers that's what holds us back almost 80% of the time. What do you think?
Karen: I do think, as a coach and as a coach who hires coaches... This is where a coach can help you listen to yourself. Because yeah, you have to talk to your girlfriends, but there's a point where I think that's the job of a coach to go, what do you really want? And to really dig deep into who you are and what you want, and to find that plan, without going to the external plan from someone else. Like, okay, now we're coming back to you and where is your heart leading you? And what are your emotion and all of those things telling you about what you want and where you should go?
Kristine: Exactly. Yeah. And I, a hundred percent agree with you on that because yes, that is the next step. Because that coach is there to help you discover this and you don't have like ties to that coach where, you know, you and that coach never lived your childhood together.
There's no, like, baggage is what I'm saying. Whereas your girlfriends, like you have a history and then it's they know you from this. Age. And you were not like this, so they might not accept you yeah. For what you want to do next. Whereas a coach is not ever going to say oh, you can't do that.
Karen: [35:04]"But you always said you wanted to be an accountant" or ...
Kristine: It's like, there's no like dissonance happening. Like when you talk to your girlfriends, like, it depends on the girlfriend. If they're supportive, amazing. But there are some who are like, but why? And that's okay. That's fine. Yeah. But if you take, you need to take the advice and the guidance of a professional who has no strings attached to your past...
Karen: To your outcome either. Like they want you to have success on your terms and they're in your corner for that reason.
Kristine: Yeah. A hundred percent.
Karen: Did you ever work with a business coach? And did that support you on your path?
Kristine: Yes. That is the first person I hired. I just knew I was in my head all the time. And I have all these issues about trusting myself. And so I need somebody to just be there to support me. And that's how I was able to launch all the things that I did. And yeah, that's actually the first person I hired.
Karen: Yeah. Makes sense. Me too.
Kristine: I'm so grateful for that.
Karen: Was it a business coach?
Kristine: Yes. Yes. So actually she's a fitness coach as well as a business coach. So she has both. She had a psychology degree, et cetera. And so I was actually going to her studio for fitness. And then I just got to know her. And I just knew, like, she was the one in terms of if I ever needed someone to talk to who was, a good sounding board, not biased like it would be her. And then she also launched an online course herself. And so it was just like, I trust you. You've done everything that I want to do, so please help me. And then not only did she help me launch my Bookkeeping Bootcamp when they were still just workshops. She also just helped me with a lot of mindset.
Karen: It's funny. I was thinking about this recently. Sometimes the reason I work with a coach now is because it's easier, to be honest. I am trained as a life coach, and I know the tools, I can work myself through things, but sometimes it's just so much easier to have someone help you. To go, hey, I'm stuck here, can we talk about this? And it's such a relief to be like, okay, I'm stressing about this stuff, but I know I can talk to my coach about it.
Kristine: Yes. I was super interested in the life coach stuff too. Cause that's I have this idea of taking my business there, but I'm just not sure yet. So I'm in the asking phase, where I'm like, is the life coach thing, for me? Or do I just do whatever? And I know as a coach, you're probably like, ah, they need to regulate this business because. Everyone can just say they're a coach when they're not like, does that bother you?
Karen: A little bit.
Kristine: It would bother me too.
Karen: Okay. Trudi LeBron has an awesome podcast on this and she talks about the idea of, should it be licensed? Yeah, like anyone can call themselves a coach and there are probably lots of great coaches who aren't certified or who didn't go through a training program. And that's okay. And there, on the other hand, there are probably coaches who aren't that great, who did go through the program. So there's that side of it. The certification doesn't necessarily make you the coach, but I think there are a few things that help, in terms of, ethics and confidentiality.
Kristine: I know you're big on that one, for sure.
Karen: Yeah. Well, I don't leave a session with a client and go talk about it on Instagram. I'm not talking about it on my Instagram because that's confidential. And, I think people who haven't been through a coaching program don't have that beat into their heads as much.
And I really did have that beat into me. Like, what does confidentiality mean? And I think coaches who are trained know the difference between coaching and consulting and mentoring and therapy.I'm very aware, If I'm concerned that somebody needs the help of a psychologist, I'm not going to pretend that I can walk them through depression and anxiety.
Not that we can't work together, but they probably need the support of a therapist as well. And I'm making this into a bit of a tangent, but some people who call themselves coaches are trainers or they're educators, or they are cheerleaders. And maybe you need someone to cheer you on or to encourage you. But for me, what a coach does is they understand change. They understand how change works and how to help you get through that. So usually there's a transformational aspect of it.
Kristine: True, true. Yeah, you're right.
Karen: But it's not advice. It's not advice giving, it's not right. And I think a lot of "coaches" give advice.
Kristine: [40:02] Yeah. Because coaches help you through consulting gives you advice. Mentoring is the cheerleader type and guide.
Karen: A mentor is someone who is further along the path than you. They may be in the same profession, or not. You could have an accountant who is further along than you tell you how to do that. Or you could have someone who is, I'm pretty new in business, right? I'm in my first couple of years. So, someone who has been in business for 10 years as a small business owner, they could be my mentor. Could be a consultant too. They might have advice to give me. But that's not the same as coaching. Often it's mindset blocks. So part of my work is... now I'm doing my own commercial here, which was not the plan.
Kristine: No, this is good. Cause I asked for it and then it was one of my questions.
Karen: I think it's also a part of my work is identifying, through a conversation, oh, it sounds like you have this limiting belief. And so that's a script that's playing in your head and that's holding you back.
And usually, those things are painful. And so how do we work through those to release them? Usually, it's more like jiggle them just a little bit because those things are deep set and it takes time to work through them. So that's a big part of what I do. Identifying as you're talking, oh, it sounds like you have this belief and removing those. And then also envisioning what is the change gonna look like for you, that want to make?
Kristine: I love that you explained that because I always thought of myself as more of I'm a consultant because I have that expertise, that technical expertise. And I'm also, I'm more of a mentor really.
Karen: And an educator too. You said you wanted to be a math teacher and you are an educator.
Kristine: Yes, exactly. So that's why that question of coaching and all that stuff. That's why I was like, I don't know if I'm gonna get into that. Cause I was still, I'm still asking that question because I'm more of a, "Hey, I know the answer, do this." So I don't know if I would be a great coach because I would just want to give them the answer.
Karen: It's really, it's interesting. I could see it fitting for you. If that was what you wanted to do, I could see you doing that. And there's lots of different kinds of coaches.
And, but it's funny. Cause I fall into that too, because with my career coaching background, the career coaching stuff, it can be very consultant heavy or people want to talk to me about their resumes or they want interview training. And that is much more consulting. It's, I have some information that you don't have, so I'm going to tell you about that and I'm going to give you advice. So sometimes I have to be like, okay, am I coaching right now or am I consulting? Or I'll even say, okay, I'm taking off my coach hat for a minute. I'm putting on a consulting hat. And yes, people are coming to me for different things, but it is also that awareness.
Kristine: Of like of what your client is going through and what they need from you too.
Karen: Yeah. And being aware of, right now, I'm giving advice and I'm being a consultant right now. Or right now I'm a coach. And when I'm a coach, my job is not to solve the problem for you or tell you what to do.
Kristine: So true.
Karen: It's funny, cause I am often looking at that line and asking myself that question too. Maybe it's the mark of a professional too, to not assume that they know everything all the time But sometimes the things we do help, right? Where you're like, do this, and that can calm somebody down.
Kristine: Oh, totally. Yeah, for sure. It's, what do I do? Okay. Do this. Problem solved. Yeah, exactly. Oh, cool. I love that.
Karen: We're about time to wrap up, but I want to know who your career crush is.
Kristine: Ooh. Oh my goodness. I, I honestly have a hard time coming up with this being in the middle of both sides of the career spectrum. Where... I think I explained this earlier about, I touched on this earlier, where I don't necessarily have, like, accountant career crushes because I have major crushes on the creative community. So I'm just gonna leave it at that. I know that's not going to be a straightforward answer for you because it changes a lot too.
Okay now that I'm thinking more about it, yeah. I'm going to give her a shout out because she inspired me to start Bookkeeping Bootcamp and she's a CPA. Okay. I lied. I do have an accountant career crush. Her name is Lisa Zamparo. Okay.
Karen: Oh yeah! She was at Rising Tide.
Kristine: [44:52]Yes. So that lady, oh my goodness. She came into my, I don't know, I don't even know how I found her, but. When I was questioning where I want to be, what I want to do. I stumbled upon, I probably stumbled upon her Instagram page. And I was like, oh my God, this is a CPA who is super aligned with what she wants to do.
She's also creative, she's a mom. At that time. She wasn't a mom yet, but she was just like this vibrant human being that I'm just like, I just want to be you and build my business like you. Okay. Thank you for getting that out of me. Because she is an accountant, but also creative. Lisa Zamparo, I love you. Thank you so much. And actually, I would, I messaged her and then she, we talked through a bunch of stuff and she was just so inspiring to me.
Karen: And I think that's where there's just an energy in a creative crush. Last year, I called them entrepreneur crushes. Like I'd find someone and think, oh my gosh. Look at all these beautiful things she's doing. And I think there's something about that energy and it shows you what's possible, right?
Kristine: Yes. Yes.
Karen: That's something amazing is possible. If it's possible for them, it might be possible for you too, and that's the power of having a career crush. If you're feeling uninspired, like maybe you need a career crush.
Kristine: It's so true. So true. Yeah. So I love that question now actually, because I was like, thinking about it, I'm just like, oh, I don't know who my career crashes and now we know now I know. Yeah. And actually, she knew that from the beginning. I always tell her I'm like, you know what, thank you so much for doing this for me. Inspiring me to do this. Yeah.
Karen: That's so awesome. Yeah, it makes you believe it's possible. And then look at that. You can make it happen.
Kristine: Exactly. Oh, so good. And those. And she also helped celebrate things with me when I did launch Bookkeeping Bootcamp and she [said], Oh my God, you did it. Oh, So good. Feels so good. Yeah.
Karen: On that note, so people can find you at Caritas Company.com or on Instagram @caritasccompany. What do you want them to know about? Like obviously, Bookkeeping Bootcamp is for solopreneurs entrepreneurs?
Kristine: Yeah, so mostly solopreneurs and startups. So it's like your basic beginner course for doing your own bookkeeping and accounting. So if you have recently just incorporated or are planning to, or just started your business and you're like, what the hell am I doing? Or if you're a seasoned entrepreneur, but never got around to learning about your books and how to do these things, then Bookkeeping Bootcamp is perfect.
It's a six week online course. That is both self-paced learning as well as live meeting. So live coaching and consulting. And it's just a great community for business owners to learn about money in their business.
Karen: It was so empowering. I took it last year. I highly recommend it. Just to give you that confidence about money and to know that there are people out there who can help you like Krista. Yeah. Yes. So Christine starts all of her meetings with dancing. She's very much a hip hop person. And so all of these things where if you have all these assumptions about a couch as being boring or dry, like it's going to break apart, totally leave them at the door. We're going to start with a dance party here.
Kristine: We're going to have a dance party. And I always, that's why I call myself a hype woman, a financial hype woman, because it's let's just be excited about our finances and what's possible because that's really what people need. Sometimes it's just we get so down on ourselves about, oh, I suck at money. I'm so bad with money. I don't know anything. I think you mentioned that in the beginning. It's I don't know. It's too hard. And I'm here to hype you all up through that. Yeah.
Karen: Which, yeah, man, when we're, when you're a small business owner, you need that.
Kristine: Yeah. Yeah. You need that. Exactly. Yeah. That's where you can find me. I am not running Bookkeeping Bootcamp until the fall of 2021 though.
Karen: So get on the waitlist.
Kristine: Yeah, get on the waitlist is the first step. And then if you need immediate help, I have other programs available for you. Just check it out on my website.
Karen: Great. Thank you so much for being here. It's been lovely to talk to you and hear about your story, how it started, how it's going. And I think the thing about intentional careers too, is when I talk to people about their path, we know also that. We're still on the path, right? I'm not assuming that you're at the pinnacle. I know that you're at a place that's much better than it was when you. Didn't want to get out of bed in the morning, but it's interesting to hear you like, what's next for me? Is it coaching?
Kristine: Yeah, exactly. It's I don't know if there's ever a pinnacle. Is there a pinnacle, I dunno.
Karen: I don't think that's the point.
Kristine: I feel like there isn't no, there's no point. There's no point. Just stop now. [laughs]
Karen: It's I don't know. For me, it's about continually creating the life you want. And a career's a big part of that right?
Kristine: [50:03]Yes. A hundred percent.
Karen: Okay. Thank you so much for being here. I so appreciate it.
Kristine: Thank you so much for having me.
Karen: [Outro Music] Thank you so much for listening. That means so much that you chose to spend part of your day with me. If you enjoyed this episode, go to Apple Podcasts and leave a five star review. It helps other people find the podcast. And my hope is that if more people find the intentional career podcast, then more people can create their own intentional careers.
If you're ready to create your intentional career with the support of a coach, schedule a call with me. There's a link in the show notes, or you can go to intentionalcareer.co and click the blue “Schedule a Call” button in the top right corner. Episodes of the podcast are released every second Wednesday. So I'll see you in two weeks for more of the Intentional Career podcast.
Resources
Trudi Lebron’s podcast - Business Remix - Should Coaching Require Certification?
Rising Tide - Website
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